DC in the 80s interviewed by Ed Catto for Mike Gold's ComicMix

We are elated to announce that ComicMix - a comic book & pop culture website overseen by Mike Gold (yes, THAT Mike Gold) - has taken interest in our humble little 80s-centric webzine and decided to interview myself and executive editor Mark Belkin regarding the origins of this site and our favorite material from DC comics (circa 1980s).

ComicMix is kind of a BIG DEAL to us since it's regular roster of columnists include notable 80s greats such as John Ostrander, Dennis O'Neil, Mindy Newell and Mike Gold himself. Robert Greenberger has also been known to pitch in a review article or three.

Ed Catto, who is also the co-founder of the Bonfire Agency, conducted the interview. Not only is Ed a marketing strategist, he's no slouch when it comes to illustrating, either. Ed graciously allowed us to share two of his recent pieces:

  

Our interview is up at: http://www.comicmix.com/2016/10/17/ed-catto-talking-about-and-with-dc-in-the-80s/



Here's a few other Ed Catto articles/interviews (written for ComicMix) that you may enjoy:

• Ed Catto: That Other British Invasion
• Ed Catto: World’s Finest Anticipation... and Trepidation
• Ed Catto: Paul Kupperberg Looks Up Into the Sky!
• Ed Catto: Paul Gulacy – More than just the Master of Kung Fu
• Ed Catto: Murphy Anderson – A Legend and a Gentleman

Batman v1 #408: The New Adventures begin

Batman #408 takes place immediately after Frank Miller’s Batman Year One storyline (Batman #404 - #407) which, as we all know by now, was essentially the post-Crisis reboot of Batman. DC wanted you to realize the continuity of this series had changed drastically, so they made sure to re-name it to Batman: the New Adventures starting with this issue. What’s interesting is that this issue re-introduces Jason Todd to the post-Crisis DCU.

If you were reading Batman during the 80s you are probably well aware that Jason Todd debuted in Detective Comics #524 (1983). Jason Todd was introduced back in 1983 because Dick Grayson (the previous Robin) had gone on to star in his own team book (The New Teen Titans) and didn’t really fit the 'youthful sidekick' role anymore. (Dick Grayson is first and foremost a Batman character, so any control over his characterization had to go through the Batman editorial team first. Somehow, Marv Wolfman [writer of New Teen Titans] managed to get then-Batman writer Gerry Conway to agree to Wolfman’s plans for Dick Grayson.) Jason Todd was introduced as a near identical clone of Dick Grayson (ex: part of a circus trapeze family, orphaned after parents were murdered, nice enough kid) when it was determined that the Batman series didn’t really work unless Batman had a sidekick to banter with. The pre-Crisis Jason Todd became a member of the Batman Family shortly after his 1983 debut, but he pretty much disappeared after Crisis on Infinite Earths in 1985.

Batman #408 starts with Robin (Dick Grayson) and Batman fighting the Joker, and Robin getting wounded and left dangling for his life - the image of Robin hanging by his legs in the ad is an exact replica of a panel found on the second page of the issue. After all action is resolved, Batman tells Dick Grayson that it’s too dangerous to be Batman’s sidekick and that Dick should move on with his life (and we get a brief cameo of Dick as Nightwing). The rest of the issue goes onto to describe Batman’s first encounter with the new, younger Jason Todd. This issue is the first in a four issue story arc that concludes in Batman #411 - the end result is Jason Todd becoming the new Robin. Max Allan Collins wrote all 4 issues introducing the new Jason Todd. He wrote one final issue before Jim Starlin picked up the title and pretty much concluded the saga of Jason Todd. Starlin managed to resolve a dangling plot-line left open by Collins’ story arc, and included what I consider the epilogue of the re-intro to Jason Todd storyline: Batman #416. In Batman #416, Dick Grayson (as Nightwing) returns to confront Batman for kicking him out of his life and replacing him with Jason Todd. In this issue we get the summarized version of the origin of the post-Crisis Nightwing (remember, Nightwing was first introduced in 1984’s Tales of the Teen Titans #43). Crisis on Infinite Earths did not affect Dick Grayson/Nightwing THAT much, however his tenure as Batman’s sidekick had been shortened to 6 years and Batman booted Dick Grayson out when he was 18 years old. Immediately after this issue we go into Starlin’s Ten Nights of the Beast story arc.

Fan reaction to the new post-Crisis Jason Todd was not that positive. Collins’ gave us a Robin that was completely different from the status quo. After the Crisis On Infinite Earths there was a chance to reboot Jason Todd and make him his own character rather than a Dick Grayson clone, and Collins decided to take a chance and try something new. Jason Todd was brash, he was angry, he was excessively violent, he charged into battle without thinking, and he had none of the traits his previous incarnation had (ex: no circus background). Anytime you try something new there is always potential of a backlash from 'purists’ - and the fan reaction to Jason Todd was one of those examples.

Collins had already written two issues of Batman prior to re-introducing Jason Todd - he wrote Batman #402 and #403 (with some assistance from Jim Starlin). Collins had previous experience writing for detective/mystery comics (ex: Ms Tree, Mike Danger, Dick Tracy) which led to him being hand-picked by editor Denny O'Neil to darken the tone of the series to set it up for Frank Miller’s Year One storyline (both #402 and #403 have excerpts of an essay Collins wrote comparing Batman to Dick Tracy). I can’t imagine following up anything Frank Miller wrote would be very easy, since Miller was the fan-favorite at the time and would've been a tough act to follow. Fan reaction to Collins’ more traditional Batman stories didn’t go so well when compared to Miller’s newly established grim-and-gritty tone. Collins quit before DC could fire him. Toys R Us would later reprint the Collins' Batman issues and repackage them with Batman action figures they were selling in the early 90s.

Collins' essays from Batman #402 & #403. Click to enlarge and read.

For whatever reason, I completely forgot everything about this story arc, and it felt like I was reading it for the first time when I finally got around to re-reading it for this review. I was most surprised that Max Allan Collins wrote it, and if I had known, I probably would’ve waited a month or two since I just wrote an article about Mr Collins (see: Wild Dog) and I normally try to space things out a bit. I really enjoyed the re-intro to Jason Todd story arc and felt like the issues just flew by as I read them (as in: it was fast-paced, suspenseful and left me wanting more). Denny O'Neil mentioned that he had scheduling problems for that book and that a few issues fell behind schedule - this becomes apparent as you realize the Jo Duffy issue (Batman #413) was a fill-in. I don’t know why Jason Todd received such a bad rap, I liked where the story was going and was curious to see how things would resolve themselves. It seemed like the other writers after Collins weren’t sure what to do with Jason Todd - some would downplay his violent angst-y tendencies, and some would disregard them completely.

There were a few continuity problems with the story arc, but O'Neil quickly explained that issue #408 was a flashback tale that occurred 3 years in the past (at the time the story was written) - and if you do some DCU math, that kinda sorta syncs up with the post-Crisis Teen Titans continuity. A popular example of everything that was wrong with the Jason Todd character was a scene in Batman #415 (a mandatory Millennium cross-over story that disrupts the whole flow of the story arc - I can imagine Starling being pretty irritated that he had to include a story about Commissioner Gordon being a robotic imposter - but I digress) in which Jason Todd wields a shotgun and starts shooting at some armed guards trying to attack them. This was absolute Batman blasphemy, many Batman fans felt, as Batman never condones the use of guns - not even for his sidekick. Despite what the 'true' Batman fans felt, I think this was my favorite scene from the whole story arc and an indicator of the direction comics would be moving in the future - pushing things to the extreme even if they didn't make much sense for the character.

This article original published on the DC in the 80s tumblr in Nov 2013. 

Cosplay male pin-up: Nightwing

Nightwing was cosplayed by Brian Milne (aka Test Subject B Labs) and photographed by David Ngo (aka DTJAAAAM) at FanimeCon 2013.
 
We couldn't just post the above photo without adding the next photo to compliment it. Also taken at FanimeCon 2013, but this time by Emilia Mccabe (aka iizel). This photo has Brian Milne posing with Skip cosplaying as Robin.




The New Teen Titans ongoing series (which debuted in 1980) saw Dick Grayson evolve from Batman's teen-aged sidekick to a competent young adult who would lead the Teen Titans (and arguably be known as one of the greatest leaders in the DC Universe). Actually, the whole series is about these former sidekicks and young adults 'coming into their own' which is what made the New Teen Titans so appealing to fans - kind of like those 1980s teenage 'coming-of-age' films John Hughes was so well known for.

Of all the different iterations of Nightwing out there, THIS is my favorite costume. This is the costume Dick Grayson wore when he debuted his NEW Nightwing persona back in Tales of the Teen Titans #44 (1984). I honestly can't visualize the 1980s Teen Titans without Nightwing in the group pic. (Maybe it's the garish blue costume? I don't know.)

The big "reveal" from Tales of the Teen Titans #44 (1984)

Regardless, this particular costume is affectionately known as the "Disco Nightwing" costume thanks to the body-hugging properties of the outfit, the flamboyant patterns, the HUGE pointed popped collar and the open neckline that starts at the chest (designed as a nod to Grayson's circus roots, I'm sure), but the similarities to the 70s Disco suit are undeniable.

The Disco Nightwing is a difficult cosplay to pull off correctly, and what I like the most about these pics is that this is exactly how I would've imagined Dick Grayson to look if he were a real person and existed throughout the 1980s. How old was Dick when he first donned the Nightwing costume? Well, it's kind of tough to say - series creator Marv Wolfman places Grayson somewhere between the ages of 16 and 18 years old when he first began leading the New Teen Titans as Robin, so I'd be guessing Grayson becomes Nightwing sometime in his early 20s (the whole Crisis On Infinite Earths thing makes it difficult to gauge an actual age).

For anyone who didn't catch it, David Ngo's photo is a clever jab at all those 'posterior shots' Nightwing is so famous for - Nightwing has consistently been voted as having one of the nicest backsides in comics and is frequently being positioned in panels to exploit that. David Ngo takes a lot of fantastic cosplay photos and we plan on showcasing more of his work in the future.

Emilia Mccabe's photo is brilliant because a) it features Nightwing with Jason Todd Robin*, b) they are both in a fighting stance and kind of look how I'd imagine if Dick Grayson and Jason Todd were about to throw down against you, c) Skip (cosplaying Robin) looks exactly how I'd imagine a 12 to 14 year old Robin would look in juxtaposition to a twenty-something year old Nightwing, and d) the color filter on the photo makes it looks like it was taken from sometime in the 80s. Absolutely smashing.

We managed to track down Brian Milne and ask him about this very kick-ass tribute to Dick Grayson and his love of the Teen Titans.

"I chose that Nightwing because I grew up loving the original Teen Titans. When I was putting that costume together I was originally working on the 90s Knightfall-era costume but I decided to switch it up", Brian told us.

Born in the late 80s, Brian grew up with a brother who was ten years his senior who was already well-experienced with comicdom, and thus he was raised on 80s and 90s comics along with old sci-fi and horror movies (which are basically the best things to be raised on).

When asked about his favorite Teen Titans story line and if he's still reading the title: "Favorite story line is a tricky one [laughs]. I always loved the entire Judas Contract story line, that was one of my faves. I haven't been reading the newer stuff due to always being busy." Brian is a HUGE Teen Titans fan and even went so far as to show us a photo of his comic book collection.

And then we asked him when he thought the series peaked? [I volunteered that I thought it was just before the early 90s when baby Wildebeest joined the team. -J] Brian replied "For me it was around the same time. I did like the reboot series featuring the new team led by teen Atom. The one right after Zero Hour."

Brian's favorite Robin (Dick Grayson, Jason Todd, or Tim Drake)? "When I started Drake had just become Robin and Dick was already Nightwing, so Tim had a bit more of an edge there. Along with the new costume made by Neal Adams."

And finally: "The Classic Nightwing suit took me about a week to make from beginning to end. The toughest part was laying out the little black elastice into place for the chest details - that took a day on it's own."


We were also lucky enough to also get a hold of Skip and ask her about her cosplay choice. Skip is a MAJOR BatFamily fan and told us "I chose Dick Grayson/Robin because I love the character and I think the costume is really funny (like all costumes from the 80s). I'm a huge fan of the BatFamily and Batman comics. I've been following the comics since I was very young and it would almost be easier to say which comics I haven't read! My favorite comics would probably have to be Nightwing: Year One and the Impulse series from the 90s. I also really enjoyed Batman: No Man’s Land and Dick’s run as Batman with Damian as his Robin before the reboot. Like I mentioned, it’s almost easier to say what I haven’t read and it’s really hard to pick a favorite!"

iFanBoy.com wrote a really in-depth history of Dick Grayson (with images) that we couldn't help feel inadequate if we didn't include: http://ifanboy.com/articles/dc-histories-dick-grayson-robin-i-nightwing-ii-batman-iii/

*Skip later told us that she was actually cosplaying Dick Grayson Robin in that photo. I'm choosing to overlook that. Dick Grayson and Jason Todd being photographed together is more comic accurate, and why crush our fanboy dreams of having Nightwing posing with the angriest pre-teen ever in a vintage photograph?

Review of the Shadow of the Batman deluxe reprint series

Reprinting older material was nothing new for DC comics (see: DC Blue Ribbon Digests), but in the early 80s the new Baxter paper format was all the rage and several acclaimed comic runs were being selected to be reprinted with the new upgraded paper stock. You have to remember that this was before reprint TPBs became "a thing". I’m not 100% how they selected which comic runs to reprint - some are pretty obvious (I’m sure 1986’s Roots of the Swamp Thing was reprinted because Saga of the Swamp Thing was getting a lot of attention thanks to the Alan Moore treatment), but I’m going to guess that some were based on fan request (ex: Simonson and Goodwin’s Manhunter) since I don’t think they had the commercial appeal to launch an ongoing series. Whether that was the case or not, in 1985, Batman fans were lucky enough to receive a deluxe reprint of Steve Englehart’s Detective Comics run in their local comic book shops.

Shadow of the Batman reprints Detective Comics #469 - #479 (1977-1979), stories from House of Mystery issues #254 and #274 (1977 and 1979), a 2-part story from Weird War Tales issues #51 and #52 (1977) and a story from Mystery in Space #111 (1980). The common denominator in all of these stories is that Marshall Rogers had something to do with all of them (whether he was the colorist or illustrator), so this almost seems like a tribute to Marshall Rogers. It should also be noted that every wrap-around cover of this series was (beautifully) illustrated by Rogers.  

Englehart had been writing for Marvel Comics in some shape or form since the early 1970s. By 1976, due to disagreements with new Marvel editor-in-chief Gerry Conway, Englehart quit Marvel with the intention of moving to Europe. Jenette Kahn (who had just became the new DC comics publisher) managed to get a hold of Englehart before he left. Kahn was insistent that Englehart work for DC comics to help ‘fix’ Justice League of America since all of DC’s big-name talent had recently migrated to Marvel comics. Englehart reluctantly agreed, but on the condition that he only worked with DC comics for a year and then would resume his travels to Europe. Part of the deal also included Englehart being able to write Batman since it was one of his favorite characters. Englehart wrote the scripts for the issues he was assigned to and then took off for Europe, never knowing who would be illustrating them or if they’d ever see print - just hoping for the best. Englehart’s Detective Comics run was such a big hit with the DC editorial staff that he was asked to add an additional issue to the originally planned 7-issue run. 

I know from experience that proclaiming something to be “the DEFINITIVE Batman” is a hot-button issue among Batman fans, but we can’t deny the impact Englehart’s run has left on the Batman mythos:
 

• the re-introduction of the newly-costumed Deadshot (last seen in 1950’s Batman #59). Deadshot would go on to play a major role in John Ostrander’s 1987 Suicide Squad series.
• the first appearance of Dr. Phosphorus. Yes, Englehart created Dr. Phosphorus.
• the re-introduction of Hugo Strange (last seen in 1940’s Detective Comics #46). You know that famous story where Hugo Strange discovers Batman’s secret identity? Yes, it’s in here - Englehart wrote it.
• the first appearance of Rupert Thorne (created by Englehart and Walt Simonson). Rupert Thorne would be a major recurring character in 1992’s Batman: The Animated Series.
• the Joker “Laughing Fish” story. An infamous Joker story that has been reprinted/re-adapted more times than I can list. It set the stage for the homicidal maniac Joker that we all know and love.

The problem here is that DC’s ad campaign didn’t do this reprint series any justice - this house ad only took up a third of a page and seemed like it was included as an afterthought. I guess readers were supposed to see Englehart’s name and recognize that it was good? The art in this ad doesn’t even begin to hint at the true artistic beauty of this series. It contained forty pages with no ads, featured higher quality paper stock/coloring, and was illustrated by Walt Simonson, Al Milgrom, Marshall Rogers and Terry Austin (not all at once). From the point of view of a Batman fan, this is a very entertaining reprint series: Bruce Wayne/Batman was now operating out of a swingin’ downtown penthouse in Gotham City (as opposed to Wayne Manor), Dick Grayson Robin makes a few appearances, Silver St Cloud (a fan-favorite love interest for Batman) is introduced, and a terrific assortment of Batman rogues are featured (ex: Joker, Deadshot, Hugo Strange, Dr Phosphorus, Penguin and Clayface III).

Englehart has stated in the past that his aforementioned work on Detective Comics (which he has nicknamed 'the Dark Detective’ run) was pivotal in the development of Tim Burton’s 1989 Batman film. Englehart has always remained officially uncredited for his contribution to the 1989 Batman film. Englehart’s run has also been collected in 1999’s Batman: Strange Apparitions TPB.

On an interesting side note, I wanted to comment on DC’s decision to reprint the two stories from Weird War Tales #51 - #52 in this series. Upon first inspection, the stories have much ado about nothing - it’s a story about animorphic dogs living in a post-apocalyptic London, England. Upon further research I discovered that they’re a part of a Kamandi: The Last Boy on Earth prequel storyline called Tales of the Great Disaster. Kamandi was an ongoing series (created by Jack Kirby) that was published by DC comics from 1972 to 1978. Crisis On Infinite Earths pretty much retconned this storyline out of existence, and Kamandi would end up becoming Tommy Tomorrow. 

*Note: Detective Comics #478 - 479 were written by Len Wein.

It should also be noted that each issue in the 5-issue Baxter reprint series had an impresive wraparound cover by Marshall Rogers. That's "tape-inside-your-locker" poster-worthy right there!

This article first published in January 2014.